Probably heli fix

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CharlotteLabyrinth
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by CharlotteLabyrinth » Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:16 pm

In addition to Ua_xp.exe, if it does not bother you, could you possibly modify ua_trial.exe (Demo) as well?
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by Zidane » Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:31 pm

You may do it by yourself, it's simple - just replace bytes

Code: Select all

7b 14 ae 47 e1 7a 94 3f 
0.02 by

Code: Select all

2d 43 1c eb e2 36 2a 3f
0.0002

However patched exe:
xp: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5H4Z ... i1RUmhaZFk
trial: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5H4Z ... 2pqV0ZXY2M
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by CharlotteLabyrinth » Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:05 pm

Found the all three offsets. Many thanks, and keep up the great work, Zidane! ;)
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by GoldStar611 » Sat Apr 30, 2016 3:58 am

Very cool Zidane! Thank you for finding this hidden detail.

It is called Delta Timing:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_timing

Looks like they never expected 4GHz multi-core processors :P
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by Bronsteijn24K » Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:25 am

Yes I know this thread is old but by god Zidane u are performing miracles!

To think we would ever get the helicopters working in their original state again is incredible. They have become much more accurate when controlled by the AI and can actually do huge damage to tanks now.

However after years of playing with the modded helicopters I invented, I have noticed that, strangely, Ghargoils and Ghargoil 2s work quit differently then I remember. For example ghargoil 2s are faster than ghargoil 1s at high altitude while its the opposite at low altitudes. Did they always work this way? I was sure 2s were always slower than 1s at the cost of more firepower/armor. But like I said I have been playing the game longer with the modded helicopters than their original AI so I could be wrong. :roll:
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by CharlotteLabyrinth » Tue Sep 27, 2016 3:09 pm

Bronsteijn24K wrote:Yes I know this thread is old but by god Zidane u are performing miracles!

To think we would ever get the helicopters working in their original state again is incredible. They have become much more accurate when controlled by the AI and can actually do huge damage to tanks now.
I was quite surprised to see that, too. With vanilla scripts, the helicopters work effectively against tanks more than I expected. I was also able to evidently notice the subtle differences and intentions behind each helicopter from the developers as well. They are all designed to perform very differently from each other. I would prefer to not change their unique individual characteristics.

Bronsteijn24K wrote:However after years of playing with the modded helicopters I invented, I have noticed that, strangely, Ghargoils and Ghargoil 2s work quit differently then I remember. For example ghargoil 2s are faster than ghargoil 1s at high altitude while its the opposite at low altitudes. Did they always work this way? I was sure 2s were always slower than 1s at the cost of more firepower/armor. But like I said I have been playing the game longer with the modded helicopters than their original AI so I could be wrong. :roll:
In the original scripts, Ghargoil 2 is a bit slower and sluggish than Ghargoil. Because of two factors:
  • Higher airconst. (The difference is very minor (130 vs 120), but there is a valid reason for it. Please see below.)
  • There are some kinematic constraints to helicopters operating at higher altitudes.
In UA, the same helicopter functions differently at different altitudes. As a helicopter gains altitude, its movement gets slower and less reactive, as well as the relative angle it needs to maintain its current height level becomes more steep towards down. This results in a more clumsy and inefficient helicopter control for AIs, especially their height controls get harder to handle for them.


AI-controlled helicopters constantly adjust their throttles in order to maintain their assigned altitudes based on a height level of the sectors they are located at. Because of the abovementioned in-game height designs, the helicopters flying at higher altitudes are having more difficulties at properly adjusting their fuselages to stay within their height range after each manoeuvre. In this case, the additional 10 drag coefficient helps Ghargoil 2 be more stable while recovering back from vertical thrust at high altitudes.

I'm confident that the helicopters controlled by users are also affected by the same (or at least to some extent) height concept as well, but it does not noticably hinder or interrupt player's helicopter controls since we are allowed to go up and down freely without such a restriction from the scripts. In fact, players can actually use this to their advantages by hitting the flight ceiling and quickly lose altitude for acceleration (potential energy being converted into kinetic energy), while ironically AI helicopters have to struggle against this same force to keep themselves remain in their height range all the time. I'm curious how AI helicopters would perform if these limitations are disabled and they are allowed to freely flutter around as they want.


The height variable is actually a double-edged sword. High altitude helicopters would have more survivability and can attack more variety of units from above, but suffers from the drawbacks as described above; while low altitude helicopters are more agile and can attack tanks better but also more likely to get shot down easily. I have noticed that helicopters at high altitudes are having a minor problem at properly adjusting their aims towards ground units, whilst helicopters at low altitudes are very adept at firing their weapons when they are turning their directions sideways in a battle (Wasp does this quite well). This is also one of the many reasons why I would not change helicopters' physical characteristics drastically, since even a slight change in the scripts can results in a huge inefficiency in helicopters' maoneuvres.

I consider this height design to be aerodynamically correct. A helicopter situated at higher altitudes would normally require most of its throttle power to maintain its fuselage at the current position - in the atmosphere with a low air pressure, which greatly lessens its capacity of generating lift (main rotor displacing air downwards) let alone horizontal thrust. This may leads to either a stall or forcibly losing the altitude. Maybe someone who are more knowledgeable in this technical field will correct me on this one.




Below is a further off-topic discussion about the differences between Ghargoil and Ghargoil 2:


I would like to point out that the major difference between Ghargoil and Ghargoil 2 is their height difference. Ghargoil 2s, while twice as expensive, fly at 600 altitude (compared to Ghargoils' 200) which is a huge advantage over other units (the only unit I can think of which surpasses this height level is a Resistance Scout with its 800 altitude, and we all know how effective it is at drawing enemy fires from most units (excluding flaks) without a scratch!). The double firepower is rather obligatory since it costs twice, and AI-controlled tanks are especially having a hard time at aiming and shooting down them in most situations.


To see how effective Ghargoil 2s are, I recommend to fight against the Ghorkovs in the mission Drak with only ground units. The Ghorkovs at there exploits an ample usage of Ghargoil 2s. Do not focus on destroying Turantul I, but rather try to control units around to observe how hard it can be to counter massed Ghargoil 2s without human-controlled planes or helicopters. The truth of the matter is their high altitude even allows AI-controlled Ghargoil 2s to destroy other AI-controlled planes as well. After that, compare it with a situation where a player would face mostly Ghargoils.

It is generally better to create Ghargoil 2s than Ghargoils since they can deal more damage and can survive much longer. But the important thing is these two helicopters are designed to achieve differing tactical imperatives. I would prefer to use Ghargoil 2s on open fields when dealing with most other vehicles, while use Ghargoils on dense urban areas to pick off light and medium tanks between buildings or as a quick measure of distracting enemies (that is, when I'm not controlling the units myself). A pair of AI-controlled Ghargoils may win against a single AI-controlled Weasel, while a lone AI-controlled Ghargoil 2 may not.


All in all, Ghargoil 2 is a unit that is designed to have a greater survivability and is superior against most other tanks and helicopters, thanks to its higher altitude and double firepower. Whereas Ghargoil is a unit that is more specialised at dealing with smaller and faster light tanks at a low altitude level, in order to compensate Ghargoil 2's major weakness. So, they actually do synergise each other very well! Yet another reason for why multiple unit compositions and varying unit characteristics are so crucial to the depth of the game.

It would have been a lot better if TerraTools or Microsoft ever released a comprehensive game document or a manual which covers an extensive data analysis between individual units, such as the one that covers major differences between Ghargoil and Ghargoil 2 like this. There are many things in UA that are simply not quite noticable in-game.
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by Brachy UA FREAK » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:09 pm

Amazing to know.
Also that the wrong helipatch has been used widley (According to Nyk on the discordchannel who is just lurking around)
GET YOUR HANDS OFF FROM THAT PARASITE!
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Re: Probably heli fix

Post by CharlotteLabyrinth » Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:03 pm

Brachy! Good to see you again. ^^

Yes, as you may already know, there was a primitive helicopter patch that changed the physical properties of several helicopters identical to the Hornet; which unfortunately became too widespread amongst the community. :( Therefore, I once made a thread to alert people about it and also to promote creating their own helicopter patches of their own accord, since the symptoms of the helicopter glitch vary between individual computers with different hardware.

As an impromptu measure, I have also released another helicopter patch that restores back the original physical properties for each helicopter with universally assigned 2.0 maxrot value for all buggy helicopters. (It is nowhere perfect, the maxrot alterations are absolutely compulsory with any script-based helicopter patches; and my sole purpose was to restore the physical properties except rotations for each helicopter.)

But now we have these Zidane’s marvellous executable fixes, I see no necessity for any sort of script replacements anymore. :D However, since I presume there are many active hyperlinks around the web that may lead to the heli-patch section of our FTP server, the script helicopter patch still remains in its place so the people who are accustomed to script patches can still access it for 'quick' applications. (Note: The more powerful your computer is, the higher maxrot values are required to satisfy the threshold of the calculations. So by all means please use Zidane's .exe fixes!)

It will be great to have Zidane's permission to have his .exe fixes uploaded into Metropolis Dawn FTP as well...
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